Can anyone tell me if you can use a line from a song without infringing copyright? To be more specific, part of a line from the 'Evanescence' song out at the moment is perfect as a title for my novel, namely 'the nothing I've become'. Could I use that as a title or would I get into trouble?

Gina.

Gina,

I'm 99.9999999% sure you're allowed to use this. Even an existing book title may be used - look on Amazon and you'll find duplicate titles by different authors. I've investigated this, and it's allowed AS LONG AS you're not trying to dupe anyone into buying your book by confusing them, OR the author and the book are so incredibly famous that everything is copyrighted, OR the words concerned have been created by the author/artist, and are not in the dictionary.
Even then, they'd have to sue you, and only J.K. and others like her have the resources to do so.

Thanks for that. Now which do you think is a better title, 'Identity Unknown.' or 'The Nothing I've Become.'?

The Nothing I've Become. It's different enough not to be trite. And after all it's only a few words strung together, so how can anyone own it?

I agree. The trouble is I've just sent three chapters and synopsis (solicited) to an agent under the original name. Still the title isn't really important at the moment, it's the writing they're looking at.

Gina
I imagine that the title is something you could easily change right up to almost publication date, so don't worry about it. And I agree, 'The Nothing I've Become' is a great title...

Digging up an oldie here I know, but does anyone know exactly what the ethics are about using song lyrics?

I've been plowing the net looking for free advice, and what has come up is that you really ought to ask first, even if you're not making a profit from the use.

I know I'm a long stretch from getting things published, but I would really like to try, and those little odd lines keep cropping up. I can think of three different songs I ripped off in "Frailty" alone, and now I'm getting the cold sweats...

And is it professional to pop a letter in the post to oh, say, Richard Carpenter... Or is it better to see if you can get anywhere with an agent first, and start asking for permission once you think it might actually leave the dusty bedroom shelves and hit bookshop shelves to collect dust instead...?

OH HELP...

A very bemused and ever so slightly worried
Ralph

Song lyrics if used in part or in their entirety are subject to the same copywrite laws as everything else however SONG TITLES are not thus you have a number of songs with the same title which aretoattly different.

The Power of Love There was The Huey Lewis song and the Jennifer Rush Song Both differnet
also Walk On The Wild Side one by Lou Reed and one by I think B>J Thomas again both different

Equally you can not copywrite a phrase or group of words in normal speech aalthough some advertising slogans are copywrite andif you tried to publish a novel say titled 'The Real Thing' you may have coca cola to contend with as to if they would win may be contentious.

If you wish to use a phrase as a title which happens also to appear in a song then unless you are plagarising the song I am certain you iwll not have any problems.

If you approach the agent they will either say no way or yes but you owe us $10000000000000000000000000 's

If you still wish for clarification contact the copywrite assosciation via their website.

<Added>

http://www.copyrightservice.co.uk/

Ralph, I don't know if this helps - it seems that even with the so-called 'fair-usage' that used to be allowed for works of non- fiction (say up to four lines) one could run into trouble.

http://www.iaspm.net/debatewhiteley.html

However, Michael Legat in Writing for Pleasure and Profit says: 'For practical purposes, however, you need not worry too much about obtaining permission until you reach a stage when your work is actually going to be published, and your publisher will then be able to advise and help you with this problem.'

Nell,

What a star... thank you. I'm going to try and stop wittering so much now
Very useful site refernce - and very interesting.

Thanks again

Big huggs

Ralph

I think you'll be fine if it is to use as a title. Using lyrics within a novel is a little more tricky. I quoted several songs in my book Freaky. An obscure Ipswichian (?) punk band called The Addicts were very cool about it and said go ahead. Pulp on the otherhan had very uncool publishers who charged me a fair whack of my advance! How much you have to pay, if anything is totally up to the publishers.



<Added>

The music publishers that is.

Thanks for that Emilia.

I've heard some pretty horrible stories about people being charged up to the eyeballs for quoting song lyrics... Could be sticky.

I think it's fair to say that if a publisher doesn't think it's worth paying, they can probably be changed/ripped out completely. My major worry was that simply by uploading work onto this site, even when it's not earning you any money, you can be charged for using other people's material...

I remember my drama teacher saying that if you weren't performing a play for profit, it would be okay not to pay royalties... Hmmm. We ran for two days in the collage sports hall and the playwright still managed to track her down and attempt to sue her. Scary. So it's made me a bit cautious...

I appreciate the advice. Thanks for that - and I'll say it here. Welcome to WW and thanks for the interview. Lots to inspire there...

All the best

Huggs

Ralph

Thanks for the welcome Ralph. When the publishers quoted ridiculous sums at me I dropped two of the songs I wanted to quote but paid up for two others. It is silly in some ways because if you use a song quote well its good publicity for the band and probably promotes sales of that CD but I guess if its a big band we need them more than they need us!

For the sake of a little copyright notice inserted into the acknowledgements bit, I think it's worth checking with the music publisher as well as the band themselves. They can afford to sue! For the most part, a credit is all that's required. It's only when lyrics are used in a different context than the original form that there is usually any objection. Having worked in music on the side of those who have pinched material and those who have had it pinched, it really isn't worth going ahead without permission.
Sue

There is a song title of 21 words. If someone pinched that... I wonder?

No prizes for guessing the song.

Len